Meryl Montgomery arrived as an Oregonian in NYC more than a decade ago. In that time she fell in love on trains, lived out her NYC dreams, and then reconnected with an old friend, Valarie Šakota, whose idea for a product focusing on low-dose highs could not escape her. In this episode, Geraldine recollects with Meryl how the NYC hustle is real. Meryl explains how her ambition brought her back to Portland where she and Valarie co-founded their conscious cannabis brand, BARBARI. Meryl also shares her experiences with therapists, how creating playlists is a form of expression, and how finding a new hobby is her next goal.
TRANSCRIPT
INTRO
Geraldine: Welcome to Amplify Your Chill, a podcast exploring all the ways we make chill. I'm your host and resident chillanthropist Geraldine Mae Cueva, the artist formerly known as Gigi.
There are two standout memories I have with Meryl: we were connected by a mutual friend named Giovanna because we were both embarking on a crusade in the Cannabis space. After our coffee date, she insisted we smoke despite our own anxiety around getting to where we needed to be next. I loved her energy and thought, “Let's do it”. I was amazed at her Shaman ability to cultivate that experience with essential oils to boot to mass the dank smell of our share joint. The next memorable moment we shared was a train ride down from Harlem to Brooklyn. She spoke about what brought her to New York City and how she met her beloved partner. It was the way she told the story that captivated my attention and reminded me of the love I have for this city. We've always related on that shared love and it's clear how much it's impacted our work and ability to collaborate as the co-founder and CEO of Barbari, meet Meryl Montgomery, a woman who knows how to own her elevation.
Geraldine: Tell us a joke...
Meryl: It is what is pink and fuzzy with white hair and about to have their ass bitten.
Geraldine: I have no idea. What is it?
Meryl: An impeached Trump… It's so bad
Geraldine: That is a corny as… impeachment joke, but it's good. It's good though. I like corny stuff. I would have never thought that was clever.
Meryl: For someone without a dad, I like love dad jokes.
Geraldine: I love dad jokes too. It's funny because it's like what's the element of a dad joke that makes it great?
Meryl: The element of a dad joke that makes it great is that it's not really funny. It's the person who's telling it thinks it is.
Geraldine: And it's like that delivery I feel like also, I actually really like that intro so I might keep that.
Meryl: Okay.
Geraldine: Welcome to Amplify Your Chill, this is Geraldine and we are again broadcasting… broadcasting. Oh my God, we're live at a listening party at Canal Street Market in New York City and I'm so excited to have our next guest on today. A friend in the Cannabis space, someone who I'm really motivated and inspired by and I love our conversations about everything but most importantly, I loved our conversations about New York. And my guest on today is Meryl Montgomery, she is a co-founder of Barbari. Is it just Barbari or bar?
Meryl: or Barbari… I know we should really choose… we can choose right now, which do you like?
Geraldine: Wait but Val's not in the equation…
Meryl: I know. She actually… let's go with Barbari because that is because that’s what she's been doing and I follow her lead.
Geraldine: Yes All right, I love that. But yeah, welcome Meryl. Thank you so much. I'm glad the timing worked out. Because I think you know we didn't know each other in our lives spent in New York, but I'll never forget the time I took the train up to see you in Harlem, you're like I'm all the way in Harlem though and I’m like honestly I just want to ride public transportation… I miss it out being out in California and I rode up to see you and then we rode back down because we both had to go to Brooklyn so it was such a nice way to, you know, have a conversation about what brought you here. Why you still you know, you are splitting your time in a sense here and you know, just like a little love story in there and...
Meryl: Trains are where my love stories are.
Geraldine: I learned that yeah. So let's, we're gonna talk about all that. So that's going to be great. But welcome, Meryl.
Meryl: Thank you for having me.
Geraldine: Of course, I'd love to, you know, tell us a little bit about you. You know, what brought you to New York. What was that initial time when you were here. Let's just, you know, walk through that.
Meryl: Cool, so I'm born and raised in Portland, Oregon and I lived there until I was about 19 and quite honestly, I was in a pretty abusive relationship. I don't think actually we talked about that.
Geraldine: Yeah, I was like, oh, okay, let's get into… I like this. Thank you for sharing that.
Meryl: It was like my first love and just after it ended I really needed to get out of Portland. And so I started looking for ways of getting out of Portland and I don't speak any other languages, so that like pretty much ruled out every other global student exchange. And so I discovered though there was something called a national student exchange and with the national student exchanges you can essentially just go to another school in the state for either a term or a whole year or whatever and I was originally accepted to go to Howard University but then they canceled their program. So my second choice was New York, it was Queens College which is not really New York City right like they say it is. And as an Oregonian. it's like yeah Queens is in New York.
Geraldine: As Oregonian...
Meryl: And like it's actually at the very end of the seven line and then you have to get on a bus and then go in more. It was like a two-hour commute into the city. I did it. So I was I spent a whole year at Queens College I because I was just going to like get away from a situation. I didn't really choose something that was within my major. So I didn't… I couldn't take any classes that actually contributed to my degree. The best thing I think I could have done for myself. All I did that year was do creative writing classes, dance classes.
Geraldine: Love it. Yeah.
Meryl: I sold weed.
Geraldine: Amazing.
Meryl: And then I worked at the Anthropologie on Fifth Avenue on the weekends, it was great. And I stayed at my friend's dorm. She went to NYU and so I like lived with her at her dorm on the weekends like sleeping under one of those like taller dorm, bunk bed things…
Geraldine: You created a faux bunk bed situation.
Meryl: I did. I had like a little blow-up mattress. I had a little lava lamp. It was fun.
Geraldine: That's awesome.
Meryl: Really fun year and I just fell in love with the city. I think after just a year of not having to have that pressure on me for school kind of a year of like getting out like getting my head back, getting my heart back after that really bad situation and kind of finding myself. At the end of that year, I just was like standing on the street and it was like my last day second-to-last day and I just like knew that I wasn't done yet. I knew I hadn't seen everything. I know I hadn’t done everything. I hadn’t met whoever all the people that I wanted to meet. And so I go back to Oregon and finish my degree and then well actually I didn't even really finish my degree. Before I came back I like finish it as much as I could in school like in the actual classes and then I did my last term online. I did that online term while I was here in New York.
Geraldine: Oh smart.
Meryl: And that was like a crazy time too because I was I stayed with my boyfriend, my new boyfriend and still current boyfriend. Yeah staying with him.
Geraldine: Let's shout him out.
Meryl: Yo, shout out Ario. Okay. Thanks for letting me stay with you for the first four months when I moved to NY.
Geraldine: See you exactly you gotta make it work.
Meryl: I think that was an important thing is that like, you know, when you first least when I first moved to the city I and needed a place to find my feet. To have somewhere where I could like get a job, get a job here. You kind of have to live here and really hard at the time to get a job and still live in Portland. Like like getting a job in New York, stay here for four months got a job, got an apartment and then just started that life. Man is crazy because I was working full-time on 34th and Park. I remember my like when asked by everyone's like I work on 34th and Park. It's such a like New York street.
Geraldine: Totally.
Meryl: My… our office was on the very top floor of the building, on the 40th floor, had the like desk that was just facing the window.
Geraldine: Love it, what a New York dream.
Meryl: It was pretty cool, but I was doing school full time there. So I would go to the Starbucks in the basement or like on the lobby and then from like 6:00 to 9:00, 9:30 be doing school work and I get on a bus into New Jersey then take a New Jersey transit in, it was long days, but I'm good.
Geraldine: That's amazing. So then what would so what time period is this? You know, how long have you…
Meryl: So I moved to New York in December. I moved back to New York in December of 2011. My first year that junior year of college. I was there 2009-2010. So about a decade.
Geraldine: We talked about, you know, you being co-founder of, I met you through the Cannabis space and I remember we had we went to have coffee at Intelligentsia and on Abbot Kinney. And, we, I remember we smoked together and I was like I got so high and I felt like such an idiot because...
Meryl: I almost missed my flight that day.
Geraldine: And I had a meeting after our meeting.
Meryl: It was my brother's wedding.
Geraldine: Yeah, and I remember thinking like, oh my God now I'm incredibly anxious, more anxious than I already was.
Meryl: Which is so not, Barbari brand, by the way.
Geraldine: Yeah. Exactly.
Meryl: We're all about not being too high.
Geraldine: Yeah. So let's talk about that. You know, I've always, you know, I am a big fan of your product, your brand, what work you guys do and what it means and you know in light of all of that yet you were just we were just talking about your new website that launched and all that nearly almost...
Meryl: It really almost killed us.
Geraldine: It almost killed us, you know, and like I think...
Meryl: Labor of love.
Geraldine: Labor of love, but let's talk about that. You know, how did you get to that point where you know, you've been, you've been at it now for a while.
Meryl: Yeah Valerie my co-founder, shout out to Valerie.
Geraldine: Yes. Hey Valerie!
Meryl: So she and I went to college together at Oregon State and we had this really beautiful setup where it was our sophomore year. And we lived in this cul-de-sac. So there's four houses in the cul-de-sac and I lived in the house. She lived in the house and there are four women in each house. And at least one woman knew another one woman in one of the other houses. So we were all friends. We're all connected in some way. So once we figured out very quickly that we were all really connected it became a super open door policy. Like there was one time where and my bathroom was completely taken over by a swarm of flies like a thousand little...
Geraldine: Why that sounds awful?
Meryl: I'm pretty sure something died in the wall? I don't know my God. So I was like using all their bathrooms like a very open door and so we just became really good friends and so during that year Valerie started mixing these herbal blends with weed. She started doing it to really moderate the dose like we're all pretty low dose smokers and weed. It's just I mean, it's really high dose today. Back then it was still pretty high dose but not as much and so she started mixing or essentially cutting, right, the weed with these different herbal blends. Then she started experimenting like okay if I use these blends it kind of does this to my high and if I mix these blends that can kind of do this to my high, so it started really changing that experience for her. And we were just like, this is cool and kind of benefited from that as friend. And that was really it. You know, we didn't really think about it much. She really kept it up and then in 2015, we became legalized in Oregon and then in 2016, she and I were getting drinks just catching up because we're friends and she, you know, we started talking about the Cannabis industry was really young still… really head shop bright, very non-branded and we were saying that there wasn't really a brand that spoke to us really ambitious young women and ambitious, cared about her family really deeply, care about our community really deeply and cared about our careers and also use cannabis a regular and sort of mindful way. And so she said like I have, you know an idea for a product and I, you know, remember those herbal spliffs we smoked in college and kind of refining that and and that's where you know, she said she I thought of Barbari a while back and just started kind of of talking about it and I fell in love and I was like that sounds dope when you do that, let me know. Like when you do that, let me know and I can help out with marketing because that’s what my background is and I just couldn't stop thinking about it. Like weeks later.
Geraldine: I didn’t know this story.
Meryl: Yeah weeks later. I was walking down so walking down 6th Ave. And I remember I was what was lunch that's going in and I just called her and I was like I have not been able to stop thinking about this and if you let me, I'd love to just help out now if I can see where this goes like it's newly legal why not now and you know, we won't know until we try wow, so that was 2016. So we worked for about a year on sort of the early concepts and pulled together sort of a squarespace site and you know really kind of piecing things together and then launched in October 2017 sort of our V1. And then yeah, we came out with our first product, the herbal blends on May or April. We actually launched it on 4/20/2018, gosh, then things started moving really quickly.
Geraldine: I know, can you believe?
Meryl: So once we launch the product we started getting some pretty quick traction. And we were accepted into an accelerator program in January of this year and then so from January to about April or May we were pretty focused on building like getting ready to fundraise and getting ready to really take the brand from what we had done so far organically and like really put some serious investment into product development and brand development. So that happened, we did a little fundraising round then launch the new brand refresh and the new product line. I mean, it was just building a website from scratch and building new products from scratch when you've never done either of those things, but well...
Geraldine: Yeah exactly.
Meryl: It's a lot of work.
Geraldine: I know but it's funny that like, I love that you mentioned that because that kind of just goes right into how you know, you're creating products that are supposed to you know, the intention with them is to help us make chill. Yeah, you know I or you know, you guys say get good… It's all about educating.
Meryl: And owning and your elevation. And so it's like what you mentioned, like we smoked that drawing on Venice or wherever, we both got way too high, you got freaked out for your meeting...
Geraldine: I did.
Meryl: I almost missed my flight to my own brother's wedding.
Geraldine: I know.
Meryl: Bad things happen, it's not good. So the herbal blends help to mediate that and so it's like whatever blends, you know, we have some for creative moments, for social anxiety or if you have trouble sleeping, some for parties that really like uplifting and kind of giggly.
Geraldine: Yeah, I mean my friend I had rolled her like the number two blend.
Meryl: Muse blend.
Geraldine: And when she was like when she smoked it she was like, holy shit. I'm so awake. And I was like, yeah, that's why I really love this, like sometimes having a lul in my day. It's such a nice way to pick the energy back up.
Meryl: That’s nice.
Geraldine: Of course. So how has you know evolving through you know, this entrepreneurship being part of the initiative, what has that been like for you, you know even imagine like that almost killed you guys. So that's like the no chill part of the conversation. But how did you manage like everyday?
Meryl: We had a developer. He was building the website and he basically was like, yeah, it's like 80% finished. It was not 80% finished it was probably 40% finished and then he just was like, you know, it's not really worth the hourly rate that I'll have for, you know, it's going to really kill you like the way he framed it was that it's going to be too expensive for us to keep working with him. So he recommended us to like Upwork this guy in Malaysia… like great love David, but it was just like …
Geraldine: I know you're like, why now.
Meryl: So yeah, it was definitely not not a chill experience.
Geraldine: How did you manage that day-to-day, you know, like what? Yeah, let's talk about you know, like what have you done for your own mental health and that way, you know.
Meryl: Started seeing a therapist.
Geraldine: Yeah. Great.
Meryl: It's been tough. It's been really tough. I mean, I think I have been sort of grappling with depression for a long time for 10 years. And you know with depression when I was living in New York, it was interesting because, I, you know, I would go for a few weeks it would I would notice I was like damn it's like really hard to get up. Like even and to get the motivation to even like do anything. It's hard to explain. It's sort of like It's sort of like your head is underwater and you can't really breathe and you can't really see things clearly. You can't hear things clearly and you're just not fully in your body. Disconnected from it. And you know, I could go maybe a week or so like that. But then something would trigger me back out of it. Now those little phases would last for it happen maybe once a year, maybe twice a year and it's like stress-related usually so then this year, when I got out of New York, so I moved back to Portland because that's where our business is, headquartered March of 2018 and so an almost ever approaching two years and it's been really hard. I mean, I think Portland has a lot of beauty and charm specifically like how its incorporated nature into the city, how green it is and how environmentally conscious it is. It's got a lot of charm and my family is there and that's great too but there's other parts about Portland that just was never my vibe and I didn't really realize that until I left Portland. And sort of created a life for myself in New York, which was all my own and then going back to the place where I was from which is really it holds a lot of… holds a lot of trauma and it holds just a lot of not good vibes and even still like, you know, I know it's all my shit. It's all my shit that I'm like seeing through this lens but it was it's been a tough, it's been a tough two years for me.
Geraldine: This feels like a release in some sort of way. I feel like you know what I really want to do with Amplify Your Chill, you know, explore these moments where, you know, we're always kind of chasing this like moment of like flow, you know, I feel like for me, you know, I'm saying “make chill” because we have to put a lot of like intention into being feeling balanced or not going crazy in moments of just like...
Meryl: I called you because my therapist told me. She's very subtle and how she makes (suggestions) as therapist are, yes when they’re making suggestions, then, she's like, “what hobbies do you do?” I don't do hobbies… like if you get like I thought if you could find time to do hobbies and I could find time to do hobbies. No one is more like you're busier, you’re the busiest person I know.
Geraldine: Really?
Meryl: You are flying all over the place. You must have some kind of status on airline.
Geraldine: You know I have but I mean, I've somebody had told me once I had heard like if you're going to aim to fly a lot try to be loyal to one airline and I...
Meryl: Delta status.
Geraldine: I have Delta status too.
Meryl: And it feels great.
Geraldine: And it feels great. Like I'm just like a low-key flex, but I earned it. Yeah, you know and I feel like in my dream of dreams like, you know in New York as a young girl, I think at some point I really did imagine myself traveling for work. I didn't think it would be this intense or what it would even mean, you know, like because even traveling is like north to south in California. And even though that's only an hour flight, you know, there's an element of like, okay I have to prepare to leave here.
Meryl: You gotta take your shoes off at the airport.
Geraldine: Yeah know like all these things.
Meryl: But you got your system down.
Geraldine: Oh Pre-TSA that Global Entry, first of all, changed the game.
Meryl: Or even just getting your water bottle ready. These are my travel shoes...
Geraldine: Exactly. Yeah, I do have I do know that there are certain things that I'm like I can last the five-hour flight to New York home in that where I'm going to be warm, you know, like right now it's like managing like all the things that I have to bring from, you know going from like California to New York like when I was just starting to get colder here because I had I came here in the fall twice for work. So it's just, even now.
Meryl: Wait, I still haven't answered your question?
Geraldine: Oh, yeah, we got sidetracked. I think it was the edible but no, um...
Meryl: How do I manage?
Geraldine: Yeah, so we were that's all we're talking about through all that travel.
Meryl: Well, honestly about traveling is a way that I manage it like I love traveling.
Geraldine: I agree, me too.
Meryl: I found some old journals; like recently I was helping my mom clean some stuff out and I found these old journals and one of them was from like my last day or know it was my birthday. It was my 21st birthday and I was flying from New York back to Portland or something and it was my last entry because I was just like on a high. I was like I think I only journal when I'm on a low, I only want to work shit out. And it was like my therapist, love her, she brought it up. She was like, isn't it funny that like your I was in the airport journaling and I was like clearly really excited about whatever I was going and whatever I had just done and there was like a moment of clarity and gratitude and yeah, traveling for me is is part of my chill. It's like I'll do a little bit of work that I can do offline that I don't really need the internet for because the internet always just never works for me. I have...
Geraldine: I agree.
Meryl: I have like a magnetism around me that fucks with all technology that shuts that shit down, watch out. So yeah, but then usually I just like take edible, my you know, get my water there, whatever, totally watch a movie or read or...
Geraldine: I relate to that so much because people ask me that all the time they're like, how do you keep up? Yeah like you travel so much and I'm just like to be honest I travel really well. Like I love the yes, I love being unplugged but it's just this like it's almost like that air pressure just like knocks me out. Like I can sleep. I can really like if I get in the right position, it's just I can have a knockout and it's just I think that refresh and then the moment that I step off the plane, I'm like, okay I know what I'm here to do. And I kind of just mentally prepare for that and I feel like that's probably you too because you're doing Portland to New York.
Meryl: Except I struggle with public sleeping.
Geraldine: Yeah, it's hard. My last flight was terrible.
Meryl: Except if I'm really tired, sleeping on a fight and I have to cover my head or my eyes. I think I can't see them then for whatever reason I think they can't see me. So that has been good. I also did microdose on mushrooms.
Geraldine: Oh, yes. I love that. Love mushrooms.
Meryl: I love mushrooms to macro and micro but micro dosing has been really beneficial. I do it on a pretty strict one every fourth day dose. Actually today was a dose day.
Geraldine: Oh so you have a like I don't want to say prescription plan, but you have like...
Meryl: They're dried up in a capsule. And so I get you know, whatever like 90 capsules and I do them for like one to, three months since or longer if I need it. And it's just a way of sort of I don't know, it's like getting my brain back on track right from when it's like in those really foggy deep depressive states. It's really at that has been really helpful. I think the trouble with bit is for me recently it's been feeling a little bit inconsistent but that comes from my inconsistencies in taking it. You sort of get out what you put in and so I have not been taking them consistently or I'm taking them like to do things and that's really not the way you're supposed to be using them. And so I've been having those inconsistent moments. I think that's I've been trying, you know, trying out other hobbies, I go for walks like the old lady in my neighborhood,
Geraldine: Oh my God, good for you.
Meryl: Listen to music.
Geraldine: You have been sending me great music lately. Thank you for those sets.
Meryl: I love music. Music is like I could just fall into and stay there forever.
Geraldine: Yeah. I wish we could sometimes honestly
Meryl: After this cannabis thing, I'm going to be a DJ but I'm gonna yeah and...
Geraldine: I like that.
Meryl: Enter my DJ career later in life.
Geraldine: Oh, all right, that's cool. Because that doesn't happen a lot for women, we need more female DJ's.
Meryl: Yeah older female DJ. Yeah, but...
Geraldine: I like that. I could see, I could see that working for you. Let me know when you're ready to launch then I'll be right there, ready to dance with the people.
Meryl: We just launched this playlist.
Geraldine: Oh, yeah, I saw that, what you guys call them? It was...
Meryl: High-flyers.
Geraldine: Something like that. Yeah, that was really cool. I like seeing that.
Meryl: Okay, so I don't know what this series is called because we don't actually named that one but the actual playlist that we just did is our sneak away mix. And it's, every so every month we're doing these ten songs because it's just ten songs like a nice little micro dose because we're all about microdose. And it's like this one since it was Thanksgiving it's like 10 songs to listen to when you have to sneak away with family gathering. Next month, it's 10 songs to listen to when you're running through the airport.
Geraldine: Love it and I'll send the review. I'll make a review.
Meryl: Then 10 songs to listen to when you're getting frisked in your car.
Geraldine: Oh my God, crazy.
Meryl: And that's been like my favorite part of the job recently has been like kind of pulling it put those playlists together.
Geraldine: Yeah, I love that.
Meryl: The fun bits.
Geraldine: Yeah. I know but those matter.
Meryl: They do.
Geraldine: You know, and they're the special parts of the brand.
Meryl: Yeah makes when I'm in the excel bits better.
Geraldine: Exactly. No, that's true. So, you know, like since that playlist sneaking away the first playlist, you know that reminds you of like, you know, these time like holidays are a little you know, they're just not that chill. It's crazy. It's the end of the year.
Meryl: No, I go to Iowa for Christmas because my boyfriend's family is from there. And he’s mom is like a very conservative Christian and like, you know, reads from the Bible before the presents and all that and she’s drug… she's a drug and alcohol counselor. Very different atmosphere than how I was raised.
Geraldine: That's crazy. Yeah, so that is, that I mean, do you… what do you do?
Meryl: I microdose. I take edibles. She once found my vape pen a few years ago. Actually, she didn't know what it was. She, I think she thought she suspected but you know, everyone denied it. So she threw it away.
Geraldine: Yeah, you know, that's funny because I was thinking about that lately when I was at my parents house and I had a vape over and it was like when I had moved back home from New York, and I remember I finally got this vape and I had this like really awesome like you could put just crushed ground flower in it. So I loved it. I would smoke it out the window and one day it just disappeared and I really think I must have just dropped it like it was swiped never to be used again.
Meryl: Fell out of my pocket.
Geraldine: Oh sure. Oh shoot.
Meryl: I remember telling Ario that I lost it. He was like no because he was like, she's going to find it.
Geraldine: Yeah. Oh, no. I know that energy. You're like Mom is definitely...
Meryl: I know, I know. No he knew yeah, she did.
Geraldine: Oh God. So like I want to talk a little bit more about you know, you started seeing a therapist and like there's definitely like I love when someone can just tell me like I just started seeing a therapist, you know, because when I started seeing a therapist. There's so much stigma around it and I really wanted to celebrate it because I could feel how much it was changing me because there were things that I had to that I that I you know, we're trying I don't know if it was so much. Yeah, I guess in some ways there were trauma emotional attachments to things and ideas that I needed to really process and bring about and I think for me, I love to just be emotionally like yeah cathartic and express that and you know this podcast like I really feel like my guests who agree to be on it are also willing in a sense to talk about that sort of thing.
Meryl: I mean, that's the podcast that I like to listen to.
Geraldine: And I still like I want to know like, you know what has been challenging in that, you know, like we're in those moments where you're just like drumming up old memories or whatever it is and you're like, you know how, it's hard. But what does that has that make you feel? You know, how do you manage those emotions?
Meryl: I don't know dude. I mean, I've gone through a few different therapists over the last few years.
Geraldine: It is hard to find the one.
Meryl: Yeah, that's kind of the most important thing and something that isn't actually really talked about right is you should shop around for a therapist like if you don't really connect with them or you know, you don't think they connect with you. There's no harm in saying like okay, I don't think that this is going to work out and then to not give up and just to keep trying to find one until you found one that I actually do like so that was really important and then so when I was seeing one when I lived in New York, it was right after Trump was the elected know and… you know, I'm seeing her for months before and then Trump was elected and my therapist was a hot mess she started crying during our session.
Geraldine: No way. Oh my God.
Meryl: I was like, yeah. Well, that's what I was like, oh my gosh. I don't think this is gonna work. I can't be like trying to do that. So I stopped for a while and I important line actually… I saw this different kind of therapist who does rapid eye movement. And so this rapid eye movement therapy is specifically used for well, it's been studied for soldiers that are coming back and have PTSD specifically with like anxiety and it technically but I don't have anxiety which is, I'm so grateful for that. So I don't have anxiety, so I don't know if it was necessarily super effective for me. And so then I stopped for a while and I just started using… so I use an app. It's called Better Help and that's because I'm an entrepreneur and my health care system is all fucked up.
Geraldine: Oh my God. I know I felt like I was really investing myself out there because I had to pay it like for the hour because you know it wasn't included in insurance.
Meryl: This is a monthly subscription and what's nice about it is I mean it sort of gives me that anonymity to like find the therapist that works for me. So what I love about my therapist is that she's actually from New York but lives in Portland or lives in Oregon so she gets both sides. Like I was really struggling to find a therapist that understood my ambition and that wasn't just sort of like writing off or like, you know, who really understood this like New York hustle. New York hustle is a real thing. And if you leave New York and you're trying to work outside of New York, there's a hundred percent, there's different working styles outside of New York, which you don't really realize until you are outside.
Geraldine: Yeah, you know, someone once shamed me like they were like Gigi, this isn't New York and I was like, excuse you, I was literally like that shouldn't even be a topic.
Meryl: It's a communication style. Like a sense of urgency where here, you know, that the expectation is that urgency right on the expectation is to throw all of it in and all of yourself into this job and like even me and my boyfriend were talking because he has his own company as well this like startup mentality and you know, he was saying he's like what do people expect like when you work for a start-up this is the expectation is that you're going to be working crazy hours. You're probably not going to get paid that much right or at all, sometimes at all. And you know, that's like the style and I said I was like, that's actually I think only in New York.
Geraldine: I agree. I know.
Meryl: So I don't know I thrive on that energy and I think what I've noticed being in Portland is that I haven't been thriving there because of that sort of lack of urgency that sense that sort of whatever energy sort of pulses here in New York. I found a way to succeed on that and that was ripped away, it would sort of like took my breath away in a sense and really threw me into kind of a tailspin that I've been trying to figure out how to balance and I feel really grateful for Valerie, my partner for being so patient. I think creative and she's such a positive force when it comes to not only the business but like we're friends first and so we are able to kind of fall back on that which I think is our saving grace.
Geraldine: Yeah, and that's really important. I think with you know, when I want to talk about duos and partnerships because there's a lot of other emotions and stuff that goes and openness that goes along with that but you know, I love like that you mention being able to have that to lean on because entrepreneurship. I feel like this whole rise & grind idea is really actually detrimental to our well-being and to our chill and you know, I am empowered by this vision I have of chill and bringing people on here to you know, that I really respect because I recognize I feel their grind. I'm inspired by it, you know, and I want to you know, even like level up to that.
Meryl: We try to have both of us I think be represented. I think at the end of the day, you know, Valerie is really the heart and soul of the product in the brand. It started with her, it's done with her and I sort of see myself as that energy.
Geraldine: Yeah kind of be jolted.
Meryl: And I think that's what makes a good team. I hate selfies. I am not a social media really down person and I'm happy to kind of take that back seat now stuff like this I talking to you, stories. I love the stories.
Geraldine: You're so good at this. So let's talk to tell a story right now, you know in all of our love of New York. There's obviously a lot of. There's so many stories. There's a lot of ups and downs.
Meryl: But if you think if you try to Google, I think there's probably thousands of stories written about New York.
Geraldine: Humans of New York, just let us look at that. You know, that's it. I know my favorite was the stripper one like I just want to meet that woman. Oh my God, I have to share that with you. But anyways, tell me about a time where you experienced no chill in New York, you know because you've left you know what New York has done for you and how it motivates you you keep coming back. But you know, there's definitely those stories that well you're like, I fucking hate living here and it's not in you know, this is this is a separate conversation outside of like MTA issues, but tell me.
Meryl: The MTA fuck me up today.
Geraldine: It's all gonna work out. We're good.. I was like no stress Meryl like, you know me and Jenn had a while figuring things out, my previous guest.
Meryl: So I would say men behaving badly. Every town all the way.
Geraldine: Hold on. Hold on. Let's put a sound to that. Let's do a little applause because men behaving badly. Yeah, that's right, that's right.
Meryl: Every year. I have had a man exposed himself to me. It sounds like you know, it's gross. And I don't know what it is. And now I can when I first moved back I took me a little while to like this guy was like opening his door, but his back was towards me and I was like, he's reaching for his dick, please. I was like oh no, he's just opening a door. Take a breath.
So a few years ago my friends and I were getting a drink at a bar. And so one of my friends, Susan, goes.. she's like I'm gonna go down the bathroom, a totally normal thing. So she goes down to the bathroom. I'm standing at the bar waiting to order the drink and I turn to my left and I see her running up the stairs. And then she literally dives behind one of our other friends and you just you obviously you can tell something is really wrong. So I booked it over to her and like what happened and she goes, this man just tried to attack me in the bathroom. She even said attacked me and so our other friend Beth Ann, the one that she jumped behind looked up. First of all, we have the three oldest lady names in the world. There's Meryl, Susan, Beth Ann. You could not think of 3 older white lady names.
Anyway, Beth Ann looked up and she was like who? and this guy is running out of the bar. And yes Susan just points at him and we only see his back and I don't know something like took me over in that moment and I go chasing after him. I, Beth Ann comes too and we're leaving the bar and I don't know I grab this other guy who ended up being the bar manager and I was like this guy just attacked my friend and you're like in your bathroom. You have to come with me now, just no options grabbed his wrist and pulled him outside. He now he's chasing the guy. So the three of us were outside the bar and there's this group of teenagers like young 20’s, kids outside of the bar. And first off it's a nice ass bar. This is a bar with like $15 cocktails like that. They serve absinthe out of ya know found anything. And not a seedy place. Yes a nice place. So these teens outside, you know, we're like this guy just came running. You know, he just ran out. Where did he go? And they point us next door. And next door is one of those like very seedy hotels in New York and it's like unnamed, there's no lobby. It's like a signage… and like the doors aren't locked. And so we look around the lobby and I'm like opening up all the doors. And we don't see him and so Beth Ann and the bar manager leave and I'm standing there in the lobby and I see that the elevator is on the fourth floor. I just pushed the elevator button and get in by myself. My boyfriend is very upset about this story when I say it, but like I said something just like you would your aunt it... something just came over me. I don't know what it was. I think it's just like you can't you can't fuck with someone and I see you and get away. We can't live in a world like that. We get into the lift I get into the elevator and when I was in the elevator was the first moment where I was like, oh, this is maybe not the safest space. I was like, I don't know exactly where I am. I am by myself and I don't have anything on me that's a weapon and my ex stepmom growing up, she was a cop and so she did teach me like some self-defense moves and she taught me really just like how to be aware and just to sort of I don't know and my mom too, many moms. And so I just like the elevator doors open and I knew because I kind of just giving myself a little pep talk on the way up. I was like, I knew that as soon as I get out there I have to be as big as possible, I have to act like as strong as possible.
Geraldine: Yeah, you're about to confront some shit.
Meryl: Yeah I'm about to confront this guy that attacked my friend in a bathroom. And so the elevator doors open, there's a guy standing there. He had taken off his backpack. He had taken off his jacket and again, I'd only seen his back. So I wasn't a hundred percent positive that it was him. But I was pretty sure it was him. You just could. I was pretty sure and he was like, all big and puffed. I was like, “you attack my friend in the bathroom. You need to come with me right now”. That was it. Like just wouldn't give him a chance and he's like, “no it wasn't me. It wasn't me”. He went back here and he was like trying to lure me into the like backbone.
Geraldine: Oh my God, where's this going?
Meryl: Obviously, I'm not gonna go. You know, that obviously I'm not yeah go but you know, what did it for me? I knew it was him when he picked up a like cigarette butt off of the floor and started smoking it for some reason.
Geraldine: And it was still lit?
Meryl: No it wasn't. Okay. He just like he for some reason that action of picking up like a used dirty not not even full cigarette, but I was like, so I was like someone who does that is in a desperate position, and so he when I said I was like I'm not going back with you. I know it was you. On the phone with the police and I had at that point, I had like pulled my phone out. I was on the phone with them, but they had no clue what was going on. I was just yeah, I was some woman yelling that my friend was attacked and they need to come to me and also yelling at him to get downstairs because of my mind I was making I was like I'm going to have him go downstairs and he is going to sit on the curb and wait for the police to come. That's why I thought was going to happen.
Geraldine: You were like, I have this under control under control. Where's the no chill part. I just can't believe that. Honestly, this whole thing is crazy.
Meryl: So yeah, he goes running down the four flights of stairs and I go chasing after him and he runs out of the hotel.
Geraldine: Wow, you go girl.
Meryl: I go out of the hotel. Who am I on the phone with the police and I'm like, okay we're going east on 26th Street. Okay. Now we're going north on Broadway. Okay. Now we're going West on 27th Street, just like fully giving them a play-by-play and they're like ma'am you need to stay in one spot. I'm like, I don't need to stay in one. I am in pursuit. You need to cut us off, you need to meet me where I am. Yeah, let me micromanage the police officer right now. So we're kind of on a little chase. We're going on 27th. He's about to like get back onto 6th, and so I'm like running there and he is getting pissed but I'm following him because I'm also giving the police descriptions of him, he is like starting to get nervous. And so he turns around and he's like stop following me. Stop following me. It's not me, blah blah blah, and he turns around and kind of lunges at me like he's going to attack me but in that moment the teenagers that were outside of the bar to begin with… they have been following me to like protect me, I had no idea. I was in pursuit on the phone with cops trying to get this guy. So as soon as he turned and like lunged at me the like those kids were there they were in front of me and they were like yo, you attacked her friend. They were all like puffed up and it was like...
Geraldine: They had your back.
Meryl: They had my back. I was like, that's awesome, one of the beautiful things about this city is this sense of like people coming together and there are those moments of chaos and urgency when like they just come together right and that it happened and that moment.
Geraldine: Oh my God. I just did not expect that...
Meryl: And so the guy starts going. He hops into a cab and I then he hops into the back of a cab. And then I hop into the front of the cab I'm leaning in the window and I'm like this guy just attacked my friend, you cannot drive away. The police are on their way. If you drive away you're an accomplice and the right in that moment the cab driver, like look the, you know, kids in the back… He's like banging on the glass. He's like go go go was like very intense and then the cab driver just looked up and he was like dude, it's too late and all of a sudden there were like police swarming the cab. They ripped him out of the back seat and threw him against the wall. They were searching him. I like found the police officer who is wearing the white shirt, not the blue uniform, like, you must be in charge. This is the guy, I was like he attacked my friend and then I was like, I gotta go check on Susan.
Geraldine: Oh my god. Wow. A pursuit.
Meryl: Yeah, he got got. So the whole thing started as just getting drinks with friends. And so I take in like a 10 milligram edible like at the bar.
Geraldine: Oh my gosh. You know, those are okay. Go ahead, keep going, I need...
Meryl: So I was like at the bar, but I think you know, I took it and then and then I was like a hundred percent adrenaline. And so then once we got to the police station and I started to like, you know, the adrenaline started wearing off is when the edible started kicking in and like the police station is never where you want to be you and like an edible kicks in. So yeah, that wasn't I just stayed close to Susan.
Geraldine: You're like Susan now, you're gonna have to manage me. I've done enough here. Yeah. Wow, what an incredible story as that's my...
Meryl: That's a New York not chill moment.
Geraldine: Yeah, that is like so many levels of not chill.
Meryl: Men behaving poorly.
Geraldine: Men behaving poorly. Damn. I need a minute. That was crazy. Wow, so you put a man down what happens after that? Holy shit.
Meryl: Well, he goes to jail.
Geraldine: He did so he did do it. He attacked your friend.
Meryl: Yeah. He waited. Oh my goodness. He waited outside of the women bathroom and the security cam like they saw this and the police were like telling me this is how I know it but he waited outside of the women's bathroom for like 10 to 15 minutes and then waited for someone to go in alone. I'm sorry, he waited for the bathroom to be empty and then he slipped in and hid in one of the bathroom stalls and then waited for someone to go in alone. Which Susan did and when she was done in the bathroom, she opened up the bathroom stall and there was just a man like he was just standing there and he started pushing her into the stall back into the bathroom and he started pushing her in and pushing her in and she like the way that she described it as she wiggled out. She like saw an opening between like whatever the door and him right wiggled out and booked it up the stairs, which is when I saw her she was like running and the crazy fucking crazy thing is, he obviously had done this before because he didn't use his hands and according to the laws here what he did wasn't harassment and what he did wasn't assault because he didn't use his hands. He used his body. So like push her in the corner. And so what he was charged with was attempted imprisonment.
Geraldine: Yeah, because, oh my God. She was just being pushed into like the stall. That’s insane.
Meryl: Thank god she didn’t let it get to whatever he was expecting to happen. It was crazy. So he had done something else in some other district and so ended up pleading guilty and because he was going to go somewhere and so he's in jail.
Geraldine: Oh my God. Well, you did good. You did good, you manage that no chill situation, for sure.
Meryl: Like I said, it just took over me and I felt I honestly I was talking to Ario about it earlier and I was like, you know, I know it was a crazy moment, but I don't know if there was a moment where I had felt more in control, where I felt more like channeled in and like almost calm. Yeah not calm but clear.
Geraldine: Yeah, you knew what you needed to do.
Meryl: I feel you were right super clear. We're and it was just yeah, it was very focused.
Geraldine: And yeah, yeah, let's talk about that. Actually, you know that clarity that you had in that moment. You know, that wasn't that wasn't no chill moment, of course because you were looking for this person. But you know, where have you found that you know more on a positive side, you know, can you tell me a little bit about that?
Meryl: Like, when do I feel clear?
Geraldine: Yeah, you know because you've done a great job of really talking about your practices around seeking balance and making chill but where you know, reaching clarity, you know, what's the process there? How are you communicating with yourself?
Meryl: So the other day I'm really bad at making time for myself to do things that are good for me. And so thankfully I work at the space, we work with another woman, her name is Yvonne Perez, and she has a company called, Make and Mary, but she does these events monthly which are really fun and it's like what's nice about it is I just got to walk out of my office and she's like set up for it. So I don't even have to like it's like I have almost no excuse to not do it. I just enter it because the whole day she'll be like you should really do it. You really do it and I'm like, I don't know. I don't know, I should work. I know but so these Make & Mary events that she does the last one that she did was a sound bath. Now I am not like a sound bath person like it feels very LA to me. I'm like, okay, I’m gonna charge my crystals. The sound bath like it's just not I feel I have like a little aversion to like what my mom would call whoo whoo, very like whatever. But holy shit, that was crazy. Like the sound bath moved me. It was like the way that she explained it was like our bodies are like 70% water. Like I have a very overactive bladder. So sometimes minds like probably at 73. So what happens when you set like a cup of water on a speaker it vibrates. And with those rings of vibration your mind and your body can get what is called these theta waves, but then like what a Theta wave is or I'm probably explaining it wrong, but I'm pretty sure this is what it is. She was like these theta waves can essentially like move your thinking mind like the fuck over and so you can really focus her whole like sort of intention was to help people get to their heart and your mind can kind of often distract from I like you always thinking especially if you are a stressed out person, especially if you are running a company's here, already an analytical person and always kind of analyzing thing. Our minds are so always constantly working. And so with the sound bath and like these sort of series it was almost like a concert but not like all these sounds and it was beautiful. She probably used over a dozen different instruments right from like large gongs, two bowls to little bird whistles like all sorts of stuff, but it was like it was such a like it was a vibrating moment for the body and for the mind. And it was a full hour of just like going into my heart but unintentional, and like I didn't have an intention of going into it. I just was kind of like going with it.
Geraldine: Oh my God, I love that then I love how you said that because that's really how the sound bath like shifts you. Yes, that's how it feels. Yes. You said that so beautifully.
Meryl: It gave me real perspective on some different things I think in my life. And yeah that perspective was important and I needed it. And yeah, I'm going to do more sound baths.
Geraldine: Yeah. I love that. We'll do a sound bath together. Yeah, that'll be great. Because you know what when you own I was listening to what you were saying. It reminded me so much of this conversation I had with my friend Sam who we had just like danced six hours straight.
Meryl: I love dancing.
Geraldine: I was gonna say dancing, we should do dancing together. Yes, and we were dancing for six hours to her like our favorite DJ/artist, Kaskade who had a show in San Francisco under his Redux tour and you know, we actually became friends through meeting, through listening to his music, but I had told her after that I was like, I feel like a different person after that. You know, I had hydrated and smoked weed, I ate an edible during that experience. Six hours because I knew I had to have my energy I wanted to be listening, engage, but when you were saying the vibration, oh and the connectivity to your heart like that's how I was feeling when I was just like getting lost in the music and dancing because I was thinking to myself I was like one of those few moments where I could have those thoughts. You said that earlier that you needed to kind of meet yourself and I was gaining so much clarity. I, one thing that I have always kind of gone back to is this idea that on the dance floor, you're only competing with yourself, you know, and like I think like that mentality has helped me unleash myself on the dance floor and like learned that like, oh actually can dance, you know, and like move because I'm just not even thinking and there's like an element that I've used those times to help me gain like confidence because I know like when I'm out there, I don't care who's looking at me and I assume just because you know lights flash, you know, you're in the move its kind crazy.
Meryl: I'm pretty sure we look cool all the time.
Geraldine: Right. Yes, we do. I know.
Meryl: I always think I'm in my own music video.
Geraldine: Yeah, right. You just gotta be though, but it's like it's interesting. Like, you know, I was telling my friend. I was telling Sam I was like, I feel like now I get it. I have to just own that, outside off the dance floor. I know that sounds silly. Oh, that's but it's like I'm only competing with myself, you know as entrepreneurs. I feel like a very accidental entrepreneur like I have to own it, there's an element of owning it because it is hard. I have no idea what I'm doing half the time even with the podcast. I'm inspired by putting this out there, but it took some time to get to this point and I feel like, you know being authentic and true and to your movements or to your mission at your company is really, you know, reminding yourself. You're only in competition with yourself.
Meryl: But it's like those you have to get out of your head. So to realize that is so hard to get out of your head, especially when you're an entrepreneur.
Geraldine: Exactly. Or living in New York.
Meryl: I think it's that you're always sort of judging yourself. But like you have you kind of have to be yeah like you or I guess you don't have to be but I guess I do, because I guess you know, you are always competing against yourself then it's like well then you better fucking win.
Geraldine: Or like I'm but that that's true and I love that you said that because for at that's another part of that conversation I had with the where I was like, you know what I'm defining what's working or not, you know, of course, there's obvious things like oh that's you're not making money there or whatever it is. I can monetize our scale it, but we're how you feel, you know, but I'm the judge of that win or success.
Meryl: Success. Yeah, success is not monochromatic. It is whatever you define it to be.
Geraldine: Wow. Yes. You're right. You know what that is a great way to end our conversation. I like that success is not monochromatic. That's so true. And I think you know if we can accept that concept we might be able to get out of our heads.
Meryl: And there's a lot of people that are a lot of not only brands but just people that are like figuring out what works for them. Like this shift that we're in right now. We're pulling away from this sort of cultured version of success, very like already defined version. But if you look at it, I think a lot of the people coming up right now the businesses coming up right now. A lot of them went through the recession in a very real way so like even for me like when I was going, you know, when this recession was happening like that hit us hard like my mom's day spa was foreclosed, our house was foreclosed. Like we like it fucked us up. I mean, that was like a huge that was like the largest sort of defining moment I think of our generation because it created a whole generation of people who were told okay, this is this is the success like this is the system for life and you know, your life is built on that system, right and then that system collapsed and so a whole generation of people that were either just getting out of high school or just getting out of college had that system or that rug pulled out from under them. And so had to figure it out for themselves. I'm like that's why I think like, you know, you look at all the brands and like the successful ones. It's the ones that have just given a big like fuck you to the system that came before it, to whatever our parents generation. Whatever way they did it. It's like we have to find some other way to do it. Whatever that means for us.
Geraldine: Yeah an incredible point like I'm just like thank you for sharing that Meryl because you know for me when I entered into you know, I when I went to college I was doing nursing, you know, as a Filipino-American that was like the route and definition of success, you know, and I think out of fear when my family was like, oh my you got into Rutgers which college are going to choose and I honestly chose nursing out of just like I guess, nursing. Yeah, and you know, there's that's another conversation but as I you know, I shifted through that transferred schools. I pursued fashion when I got into fashion school like that was right when when I was graduating was when the economy just tanked and so for me it was like what I thought I was going to end up at one of these corporate training programs. I was interviewing at JC Penney's, Macy's, Payless got flown out to Topeka, Kansas like all these faces are like, oh my God, is this a job I want but even at that point, they weren't even like people weren't getting hired anymore. They were closing up spots and I had to completely rethink like what am I going to do after graduation. I've already left. Well, I was building as a potential four year degree in nursing where there's endless healthcare jobs or jobs, but they can't even fill them. They still need more and then here I am consumer-driven business and I'm like...
Meryl: Can you imagine if you had stayed in nursing?
Geraldine: Oh my God.
Meryl: Your life would be so different.
Geraldine: My life would be so different. I don't even know I can't even picture.
Meryl: I think you would be a good nurse.
Geraldine: You know, I appreciate that. But like I and I, people had taught me, told me like you're gonna do better when you apply it during the clinical section, but I was so deeply uncomfortable. I couldn't connect with people the way that I can connect with them via conversation or something like that or about business like being able to have like assess them, touch them. It freaked me out. And that was...
Meryl: You don't want a nurse to be freaked out and…
Geraldine: Right, and then like I remember that clinical program was postpartum. So these are you know mothers that had just delivered and there were either just you know, finishing up their stay and you had to assess their pain and like imagining touching them. There's already a sensitive thing. They've just become new moms, given life to something.
Meryl: Like their body response must have been crazy.
Geraldine: Yeah, that was the first time I really truly experienced anxiety because I was like, I don't belong here. I don't feel comfortable and you know, just even you know to wrap this up but like to shift through that was so scary because I'll look I've no idea like what am I going to do next and then it's just like finding, you know those opportunities where I ended up at a flash sale, but it was like I had to use like fundamental, you know buying or whatever and I found my way then here we are and we met through cannabis.
Meryl: We've all met through fashion actually because you work...
Geraldine: That's right with G. Bonobos? Yeah. She helped open that guide shop, and then I just like supported that yeah, I know man.
Meryl: But you haven't gone into fashion. You probably wouldn't have gotten into weed.
Geraldine: Nope. You're right I know and on that note shit Meryl tell the people if there's anything that you want to share positive about, you know yourself about how to move forward encourage people to make chill or even just if you want to talk about Barbari one last time, please do.
Meryl: I would say go to some sound bath. Oh, yeah no, I don't know.
Geraldine: I should sponsor a sound bath.
Meryl: Yeah, I think I am the last one to this party of finding things that are not work that you should fill up your time with. Finding those hobbies, I mean, I'm still finding my hobby. And so I think that's my positive message is to encourage that. I'm no longer shitting on people with hobbies I’m like one of those try...
Geraldine: Find something you love.
Meryl: Like I’m a gardener. Nope, still a walker. And check us out. You can find us at Barbarishop.com. It's Barbarishop.com on Instagram @Barbari.shop.
Geraldine: And that is the episode with Meryl. Thank you so much for being on. I love you, too. That was such a beautiful conversation to have and I'm so grateful to have it on my first season… Yeah, let's push the dream button.
OUTRO:
Geraldine Cueva: This episode was recorded at a listening party in Canal Street Market produced by Cloud Studios. Music created by and produced by Fast Lane James. Artwork designed by Jewelyn Butron and last but not least, shout out to the ladies of the Present Shop. Thank you for listening. And this is Amplify Your Chill. For more information on the work I am doing or how I make chill, follow my journal via Instagram @artandtimesofchill.